prices are actually due to go back up in the uk lol
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prices are actually due to go back up in the uk lol
thats your opinion and feelings toward p2p, and if this makes u less popular for someone than that someone is to blame... people are allowed to have their own opinions and feelings towards stuff and unless its against them they have no reason for u to be less popular :PQuote:
Originally Posted by Becky
bdw i do support p2p... i mean yah the artists go through lots of hard work to make an album an dwhen its out 80% of the ppl download the songs, but still they get their money and they dont even know about whats going on, so no reason to not support it :P just my opinion :)
My opinion:
Game prices are ridiculous, new games can cost you from $50-70. When prices were $15-20 I had a huge collection of games most of which I could play all day, alot of games now (shooters especially) can be beat in under 8 hours and have almost no replayability not to mention being loaded with product placements. Games do now cost millions of dollars to make but the companies that make them make alot more back from sales. For all the games I've downloaded I've only liked about one third if not less and out of those i've only bought 4 or 5 that I think deserve what I'm paying for them, not being able to play through most of these games first though I would have wasted atleast $10,000 in the last few years.
About cd's being cheaper to make, they're not, because of higher demand cd's cost more now then they did before. And then look at games you have to download and pay for, most of them cost the same as buying the game on cd.
With music alot of people (like me) download alot of stuff you can't get on itunes or instores like vinyl rips or livesets. Then what alot of people like is downloading all the albums an artist has released or all the albums in a series which would cost hundreds of dollars in store (if you can find them all at the same store). Itunes for me is a waste of money, to download all the songs in a cd it could cost more than the actual cd and you get music at a much lower quality without all the nce things that come with a cd. I think most people would rather have actaul cds instead of mp3s but until prices are reasonable nobody will stop downloading. I know that because of downloading I've found alot of music I would have never knew about before and have bought cd's/shirts/tickets to go see which if I havent downloaded their music in the first place they wouldn't have gotten hundreds of dollars. And that isn't just me I know lots of people that have been in the same situation.
Software like photoshop is in my opinion perfectly alright to download. If a thousand kids download it to make sigs and one of them decides to get into design then adobe gets a few thousand dollars (for ps + illustrator + updates) that they would have otherwise not made. Most of their money comes from designers working in studios that an easily afford photoshop and they do pay for it.
Also might add in 2004 album sales went up 2.3% in the states and 4.5% in the uk, in the us video game sales are up 35% and dvd sales are also up (don't have exact % but its 20-30).
Game prices are ridiculous, new games can cost you from $50-70. When prices were $15-20 I had a huge collection of games most of which I could play all day, alot of games now (shooters especially) can be beat in under 8 hours and have almost no replayability not to mention being loaded with product placements. Games do now cost millions of dollars to make but the companies that make them make alot more back from sales. For all the games I've downloaded I've only liked about one third if not less and out of those i've only bought 4 or 5 that I think deserve what I'm paying for them, not being able to play through most of these games first though I would have wasted atleast $10,000 in the last few years.
When were game prices $15-20? And you can rent games (unless you live in an area that doesn't have games to rent?). And about how long games are.. well, most game magazines will tell you that (or sites). I guess people should really start telling the companies to cut the price in half for those types of games..
About cd's being cheaper to make, they're not, because of higher demand cd's cost more now then they did before. And then look at games you have to download and pay for, most of them cost the same as buying the game on cd.
I guess I don't understand this part. And where can you download a whole game? Besides online games...
With music alot of people (like me) download alot of stuff you can't get on itunes or instores like vinyl rips or livesets. Then what alot of people like is downloading all the albums an artist has released or all the albums in a series which would cost hundreds of dollars in store (if you can find them all at the same store). Itunes for me is a waste of money, to download all the songs in a cd it could cost more than the actual cd and you get music at a much lower quality without all the nce things that come with a cd. I think most people would rather have actaul cds instead of mp3s but until prices are reasonable nobody will stop downloading. I know that because of downloading I've found alot of music I would have never knew about before and have bought cd's/shirts/tickets to go see which if I havent downloaded their music in the first place they wouldn't have gotten hundreds of dollars. And that isn't just me I know lots of people that have been in the same situation.
So.. your saying music should be free? If you are of the thought that cd's are expensive, and you know of costs that go into making them, how do YOU propose to "share" music?
Software like photoshop is in my opinion perfectly alright to download. If a thousand kids download it to make sigs and one of them decides to get into design then adobe gets a few thousand dollars (for ps + illustrator + updates) that they would have otherwise not made. Most of their money comes from designers working in studios that an easily afford photoshop and they do pay for it.
Well, I can't say that in theory that doesn't sounds peachy, but I guess morals come into play. Or they don't. If you think it's ok to dl it, just remember the legalities (if, of course, your area has legal ramifications). It is what it is.
Also might add in 2004 album sales went up 2.3% in the states and 4.5% in the uk, in the us video game sales are up 35% and dvd sales are also up (don't have exact % but its 20-30).
Where would I got about finding this out? I'm not saying it's a lie, in fact, I'm sure it's true. But that doesn't mean people downloading is the reason why...
I think what it all comes down to (because people will either be one way or another about it, and we really shouldn't argue about it anyway) is that prices could be better; or could they? I guess I don't know as I have no idea what kind of money these companies are making (from record companies to video game companies). And the real thing is, if people continue to pay for stuff at the certain price (because many do) then the price won't go down.
Only thing I can see happening is much stricter laws on downloading. Whether that happens or not, or when, who knows. But like I have said a few times, in my area they are getting much more strict. Can you still get away with it? Yes. If your caught, are you fucked? Yes :P So I guess continue on until you can't ;) Or fight the machine!
Didnt botrher replying to everything because the quote at the bottom answers alot of it.
When gaming started becoming popular (late 80s early 90s around) games could be developed by a person like you or me with almost no money needed invested in them. I remember some old console games would cos $20 new and they would cost around $20,000 to develop. You can't rent pc games (atleast not here anyways) and the prices are 6 to 10 dollars for new console games which is like 1/4th the cost of owning an older game. Sites do tell you how long games are but you can never be sure and even though alot of games are short they are still worth playing (though not worth paying for). I don't think companies will cut the prices in half because alot of these games cost more to make than other types and people will keep buying them no matter what.Quote:
When were game prices $15-20? And you can rent games (unless you live in an area that doesn't have games to rent?). And about how long games are.. well, most game magazines will tell you that (or sites). I guess people should really start telling the companies to cut the price in half for those types of games..
Demand for cd's like actual discs has increased and supply is down because the companies that make the discs didn't expect so many would be in demand so higher prices. http://www.direct2drive.com is a site that sells download games.Quote:
I guess I don't understand this part. And where can you download a whole game? Besides online games...
Most of them are from http://www.itfacts.biz/ and I'm not saying its because of download just saying that downloading isn't ruining the entertainment industry.Quote:
Where would I got about finding this out? I'm not saying it's a lie, in fact, I'm sure it's true. But that doesn't mean people downloading is the reason why...
Quote:
Why do CDs cost so much?
When they were first introduced in the early 1980s, compact discs cost about $14 or $15 -- almost twice as much as a tape or LP version of the same music. Record companies claimed that the higher prices were justified because the new discs were more durable and provided higher sound quality. The industry also argued that the high cost was partly due to the need to build new facilities to produce the digital discs and that prices would eventually fall. One 1987 Washington Post article reported that record executives believed that the price of a CD would eventually settle around $10.
Twenty years later, production costs have come down, but consumers are still complaining about the cost of CDs, which now are priced at upwards of $16. The industry's main lobbying arm, the Recording Industry Association of America (RIAA), responds that prices have come down. According to an article published on the RIAA's Web site, "Between 1983 and 1996, the average price of a CD fell by more than 40%. Over this same period of time, consumer prices … rose nearly 60%. If CD prices had risen at the same rate as consumer prices over this period, the average retail price of a CD in 1996 would have been $33.86 instead of $12.75."
Anyone who has burned a CD on his computer for less than a dollar may still wonder why a product that is so cheap to manufacture could cost so much. The answer is that while the cost of physically producing a CD has dropped dramatically over two decades, the costs of marketing that album have grown tremendously. For example, in the early 1980s, music videos were an optional route for the industry to promote their artists. Now labels are expected to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars producing music videos for all of their major artists. Even marketing a major album to radio can costs hundreds of thousands of dollars. And if an album is unlikely to get on radio or MTV, some labels have decided to launch costly television advertising campaigns to gain exposure for their artists.
However, the price of a CD isn't just paying for expensive marketing campaigns; it's also subsidizing releases by other artists that will never sell enough to make a profit. An artist at a major label may need to sell more than a million units before the venture ends up in the black. Most albums never sell anywhere near that. According to the RIAA, only 10 percent of albums ever achieve profitability.
And while the number of new albums released each year has dropped since its peak in 1999, there are still more new albums released today than there were in 1983. In 2002, the industry released more than 33,000 new albums, so successful albums today have to support many more unprofitable releases than they did during the early 1980s.
I guess I was too young to remember games that cheap. I do remember people pretty much giving away Atari games, tho :PQuote:
Originally Posted by iod
And yeah I've never seen PC games to rent.. In my area, games are anywhere from $2-5 to rent, and places have game cards/clubs now *ie, Blockbuster* where you pay like $19-30 a month "for unlimited" game rentals (2 out at a time I think). That could be good or bad depending on how many your rent, of course.
btw, nice quote.. and it doesn't surprise me about marketing being a big cause of why the prices are so high... it's the new age, where media is all over and the consumer is paying for it, one way or another.. it's kind of like the athelete debate; does anyone really deserve 30 million a year? Both sides have points to be made about that, as well.. while the people pay for it.
But in the end, the truth is; as long as people pay for it, it'll continue.
Well for me I find nothing wrong with p2p. Outside of music (which just started to get), I used p2p as a way to try stuff out. Like with anime for instance. I have downloaded more anime then I can ever remember. With all of the ones that I did like, as soon as they were released here in the states I bought them. Spending $1000s on it. Likewise with games. Its just not worth spending $40-$60 on a game in which you might not like. So I download them and try it. If it is good, then I go out and buy it. For the most part. If I intend to keep something then I go out and buy it.
NoPeace - out
One last question before I go to bed:
What's the difference between downloading, for instance, a game online, than going into a store and stealing it? Besides the fact you have the case and instruction manual, which tbh, you can make yourself anyway.
Wait, I'm going to guess it's because the game never existed, in theory, so no money was, in theory, lost? Like er it never went through any process of getting made/shipped/blah blah. No one actually paid to make it or bought it to sell it..
I'm trying to understand your guys' point of view!
The difference is that you are reciveing it form someone else and not actually stealing it. It all depends on how you look at it. I view it as someone is shareing something they have with me. I not going out and taking it from someone who aint willing to give it to me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Becky
Also beckeh, don't ack like a sweet inocent thing. We all know you do it also. So don't lie to us.
You can say private servers are just like p2p. We are not paying for it. But we still use it. Just like how we do with p2p stuff.
NoPeace - out
I used to dl music, I will not lie about that; never downloaded movies/games/software in all honesty. I have played Mir2, Mir3, and Lineage 2 private servers, although to be fair I did pay for L2 at one point heheQuote:
Originally Posted by NoPeace
I never said I was innocent and screw you for acting like I did.
btw if you couldnt tell the last part was said jokingly.. although tbh nopeace = gay
it was only a matter of time before someone took it too seriously!
usually in debates, ppl dont make jokes like that -_-
You've never debated with me before ;) Plus, it's online, and I forgot you can't detect sarcasm/jokes easily. So sue me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Elessar
BTW, I forgot, I have downloaded games before. SNES roms at one point. After my friend took my Chrono Trigger, I had to play it lol..
I'm going to stop posting on this topic now.
im just saying (as im sure we all are here now that i think about it)
but i generally dont like debates because i am usually one of the lesser informed, but like it has been said in here before. If whatever is being pirated really is worth it then chances are the person is gonna buy it. time for bed >_<
dont worry elessar about beckeh, thats how she is. and i see that she finnaly gave up :D
so the p2p'ers won :D
NoPeace - out
BT FOR TEH WIN
the day i buy music/software is the day i hav money, been 18 years n ive got no money so ill be downloading all i need !!!!!1