BBC News - Websites to be forced to identify trolls under new measures
/facepalm
+1 to nanny state I guess.
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BBC News - Websites to be forced to identify trolls under new measures
/facepalm
+1 to nanny state I guess.
really? If you're scared of the internet, gtfo. lol
Just one more restriction on the internet that is slowly allowing governments to completely control our last true method to express freedom of speech.
this...what....how...
Who the fuck suggested that thing, are they shitting us?
K, trolls apocalypse can finally begin.
-prepares my cap and trollface card
http://www.deviantart.com/download/1...megaTexnos.jpg
if this is accepted, its going to be the most retarded rule ever.
Hah, sweet. We can finally PK some trolls.
Good bye 4chan, and such.
Is THIS a troll?
Does this mean rickrolling will be illegal? if so, noooooooo!
That's actually sad I heard some similir shit they try to force in Poland, they want to pass the law so everybody on the internet will have something like internet ID which would basically identify us all over the internet.
Where is the fuck is the internet going to?banning my solo reason to go online >.<
Into the hands of our so called leaders :P.Quote:
Originally Posted by SirEpicWin
This is not really a bad thing by any means. Not everyone has stable, strong emotions. People have killed themselves because of what others say to them online. Ignore them? Avoid them? Sure, easy enough, but sadly what's done is done, you can't un see what you see.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron
Those with weaker minds deserve to be able to use the internet without having to worry about some kid across the global talking about them.
Tbh, it wouldn't be allowed to a certain degree in real life, it really shouldn't be a allowed on the internet. Only way this would affect you, like all the recent interweb lawz lately. Is if you'd get the ass end of the stick. If not it really shouldn't even concern you.
Yeah, some kill themselves but it was their choice to go on the internet in the first place. I'm sure the majority of people have something bad said to them at sometime, whether that be when they first get on the internet or on MMOs or the habbo players in Spamzilla, either way they know the risksQuote:
Originally Posted by Tsume
It's always some concerned citizen type, older unstable blonde bitch, who starts these things...
That's like a kid killing himself from bullies in school, and someone saying it was his fault for going to school in the first place.Quote:
Originally Posted by El Jamié
I really hope you don't honestly believe that, because there's definitely something wrong with you if you do.
Holy shit this is serious <-haha I trolled!!!
Watcha gonna do now government:P:?
Exactly, I was going to say the same thing, expect about work. Guess people who go to work and kill themselves due to running off at the mouth too much is their fault for working right?Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike
Nice logic Jamie.
Shouldn't just be handed over just because someone is a little bit offended, can't stand it, block it or better yet, disconnect the internet and get a life.
Sadly the internet lacks emotions, what could be offence to one person can be really funny to another without the proper 'deliverance' to the original message.
Anyway People should be allowed to surf and use the internet anonymously until fair grounds are need to expose their IP address and onwards their identity but would need a really good reason for someone else's privacy to be invaded.
Lol no one will stop trolling even if it is made illegal. Just face facts. There will always be trolls
sue you and arrest yer parents. woops....me2Quote:
Originally Posted by King Kong
If you bothered to read on, you would of seen that I said 'its a risk' and that it's optional to go on the internet. In School it's a whole different story, you must go to school to get educated and if you do get bullied you can do something about it, so before you continue with your smart-ass comments read up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike
No they shouldn't be anonymous. being anonymous causes bad things to surface from people. If you'd said being able to surf and protect your identity that would be different and reasonable. People want to be anonymous because they wouldn't be excused from doing the same bullshit in real life. There is no reason aside from malicious intent to want to be anonymous while on the internet. You can protect yourself without being totally anonymous.Quote:
Originally Posted by Evilkitten
Hold ittt, you're skitting my logic yet your coming out with this. So you're basically saying that nobody should be allowed to be anonymous even if they want to? Sure they can get protected but people prefer to go anonymous to make sure they're never at risk of getting their details leaked or whatnot.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsume
School's a risk too. Everyone knows there are bullies there, and that they could end up a bully victim. Same as in the workplace, everyone knows that there are higher ranks, and they will often be bullied by their superiors.Quote:
Originally Posted by El Jamié
Your logic fucking sucks.
I disagree with you there, not everyone who are anonymous has the intention of malicious attacks or 'troll'. The biggest reason could be they simply don't want others to know anything identifiable for reasons such as personal safety or a right to freedom of speech without fear of discrimination (even a name can set that off). Everyone has that right to remain anonymous and it's something people do in real life so why can't they do that online too?Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsume
Name one person who's ever spoken out and remained anonymous and was actually taken seriously...Quote:
Originally Posted by Evilkitten
And like I said, there's a difference between wanting to be anonymous and wanting to protect your identity. There are ways of doing that without being anonymous...
Not really surprising after all the shit on Facebook with that ugly, fat bloke posting shit about dead kids.
Can't name anyone as such but people who ring police and ask for anon are taken seriously. OoQuote:
Originally Posted by Tsume
Hurr durr and how's she supposed to do that?Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsume
My Pimp Pants thread must be deleted before I am sentenced to life imprisonment for trolling of the finest quality. I trolled even before troll was used in that context.
Lol...exactly but was trying to be good there with my reply. =PQuote:
Originally Posted by Rishwin
No, yours sucks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike
School is mandatory, work/internet is not, there's a huge difference.
You get bullied on the internet? Leave. Get bullied at work? Quit. Get bullied at school? Yea, like you had a choice about weather or not you went to school when you were a kid.
It's rare that children and workers get bullied by higher ranks. Seriously, and if they even did get bullied by them, I'm sure their superiors have people higher too. It's the same with school, if a teacher bullies you, you don't just sit there and plan when your going to kill yourself you contact someone else of a higher authority such as the head teacher or whatnot. I didn't say School wasn't at risk of things like this, it happens near enough every day to somebody but they can tell people who are of a higher authority or good friends can't they.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike
Basically sums this up in (great) logic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rishwin
@Mike, you don't get a lot of children killing themselves because they are bully victims, and before you say anything read up. I wasn't saying they don't get bullied or kill themselves, I'm saying not a lot do. Just a heads up before you start off on me again. Also, if you were a bully victim as a child and some day when you were older and left school and reflected on the times you did get bullied, you wouldn't just kill yourself would you? Your past is your past and it can't be changed. You should have a positive outlook on your future, it's not often that you get people jumping off bridges/killing themselves 10 years later. Hence the reason why schools have the whole 'prefect' rank which you tend to go to if you need help.
Jamie you have a habit of opening your mouth and saying the wrong thing. Don't, please.
Guess you could argue this is a clampdown on freedom of speech but the fun part will be dictating what is considered to be a troll and what isn't. You could say you were being sarcastic, an ass for the sake of being an ass, all sorts of excuses. Good to see the Conservatives getting their priorities right.
I'll admit honestly, I don't like being proven wrong. Everything I seem to say tends to be a Debate, and from the PMs Mike sent I guess he made me change for the worst. Regardless, sorry for opening my mouth and causing the shit I have. I'll stick to Spamzilla and Debates.Quote:
Originally Posted by Junkers
Lol making Trolling illegal is pretty ridiculous imo. If you can't handle a couple petty little insults and someone challenging your intelligence and/or reputation, than you shouldn't be on the internet in the first place.
The "trolling" that is being banned isn't the usual "God you suck" or tricking someone into believing someone, it's the people who are making Facebook Groups celebrating the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, or pages that celebrate the death of a child who has had some media attention.Quote:
Originally Posted by Justice For All
Also who the fuck are we to decide who gets to use the internet or not?
Just playing devil's advocate here; who are the Government to decide to intervene on this? Should it not be the website owner who monitors this rather than a Whitehall quango?Quote:
Originally Posted by DonTonberry
Some people simply pass the point of normal human decency and yea once you do it should be illegal. You should not be allowed to expose other people to the kind of ignorant filth which this act/law is targeting without reaping a consequence.Quote:
Originally Posted by Junkers
If you get hauled off to jail for publicly slandering someone, why doesn't the same apply when you do it on the internet in front of MILLIONS of people?
I'm all for it.
Government aren't intervening, we have antiquated laws that haven't been brought into the new millenium. We have Public Order Offences in the UK that make it an offence to intentionally or recklessly cause Harassment, Alarm or Distress to anyone of sound mind. This new law will be including the internet as a public place, which it quite clearly is.
School's only mandatory up to a certain point. Work definitely is, how else will you be able to afford to live?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rishwin
I thought they changed the Law where you could drop out after your first year of being a Freshman. Last I heard they bumped it up to you have to be a Senior in order to drop out, which is pretty pointless since it's your last year unless you go to to college anyways lol Or maybe it was they haven't yet but are going to... One of the two.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike
There's a whole world of jobs out there. Plus workplaces have grievance procedures to deal with any employee complaints.Quote:
Get bullied at work? Leave.
Yea, after which point you really shouldn't be getting bullied at that age. You choose where you work, if one place is shit go somewhere else. You don't have that option when you're a kid (i also keep saying "kid" on purpose, clearly i'm referring to primary/lower school) to just get up and change schools at your every whim. You also have specific laws to protect you from bullying and discrimination in the workplace, which do not exist for school.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike
School being mandatory is irrelevant at this point too, If you're going to drop out of high school because you're getting bullied, then you're just doing it wrong.
Just to point it out though, I am against this censorship. It's just that Jamie says the dumbest shit in every thread, and I wanted to challenge it.
Who the hell says it's the kid's own fault for going on the internet and getting trolled?
But yeah... Kid's kill themselves every day. Let's overlook it though, because it was their own fucking fault for clicking into an internet chat room/forum and getting trolled. Even if they did leave, they could still kill themselves.
Well, from experience I'd say it's the kid's fault. When I first used RaGEZONE I made the huge mistake of being 13 years old and trying to mingle in the what was the minefield of Spamzilla. I was slaughtered for being a cocky little brat and had the piss taken out of me all the time because of how I acted. Kids go onto the internet and think "Oh it's the internet, nobody can see or find me, let's me a dick" and do invite it upon themselves.
Trolls are pretty much lowest of the low, even though it can be fun and I've done it in the past. Some trolling is ok, but some people take it way too far and make idiots of themselves. +1 to this I guess, trolling should never have gotten this popular.
Who quits work because they get bullied? #1. Most people don't have the luxury of being able to jump from one job to another. #2. That's just pretty pathetic IMO.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rishwin
Maybe they don't have the luxury, but the option is there and i personally know of multiple people who have left past employers due to unsavory activity/conduct, myself included.Quote:
Originally Posted by xLethal
What's the alternative, stay there taking abuse till you hang yourself? Yea, which one's more pathetic?
Saying it's the kid's fault for being trolled is kind of wrong, yes some people do bring it on themselves, but does that make it ok to troll some one to point that they'd want to end their life? I think not, and that's where this law should step in. People do those things because they KNOW no one's going to tell them otherwise. But this is the internet of course, we can do what we want without fear of prosecution right?
Yea... The internet should be a place where everyone and anyone can do what they want to who they want and get away with it scott free, simply because the trollee has the option of not using the internet.
I fail to see any kind of fair judgement here.
The more pathetic option in many cases is quitting when you have responsibility to feed your children or pay rent and have no other way of doing so. I could understand if the employer is the cause of the abuse, but otherwise you should be able to deal with it yourself either by working with management for a solution or confronting the bully about the behavior. I'm simply saying leaving work isn't an option for some people(such as single parents with no other available jobs to support their child). You can't just say "If you get bullied at work, then you need to leave." as if it's as simple as that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rishwin
You also can't say everyone has the option of not using the internet. A good example of a case of trolling is looking at the abuse Nexon US staff receives by the players. This is their job, but they are trolled relentlessly for the company's faults rather than their own. This goes back to the fact that quitting a job isn't simple. Which would you rather have? Innocent people losing jobs, or losing the freedom to harass people online?
You didn't even read the article, do you? You legitimately have no understanding of what this topic is actually about.Quote:
Originally Posted by xLethal
This act/law is designed so that instead of the website owners being liable for any offensive published material, they lose that liability if they instead hand over the identification of the perpetrators. Now if you're abusing people, you have every right to be shamed and blamed, regardless if it's online or not. This is also a UK-only law so i don't know why everyone's panties are in a knot.
We're talking about REAL abuse here, like laughing at people for having family members die, and publicly taunting them with shit like that. Like actual criminal behavior which you would be arrested for if you did it in person. We're not talking about petty name-calling and flaming. The point is that nobody should be allowed to use the Anonymity of the internet to mask malicious behavior.
If you pay rent and have children, i would hope you have some sort of education. You use those qualifications and find another job, preferably before you quit your current job as normal human beings do when in that situation. Don't start throwing in hypothetical scenarios which wouldn't happen in real life. Nobody who is in that specific situation would quit their job first and then look for another job while having children to take care of and bills to pay.
You're also extremely naive to believe that every company has some sort of "management" - 84.7% of all businesses in Western Australia are sole proprietorships ; 1 single owner with less than 3 employees, there is no "management" and there is no complaints department. If you are in an unsavory work environment, it's tough shit either you put up with it or your leave.
I wouldn't force nobody to reveal themselves ^__^
You've hit it right on the spot. I, personally, support the idea of being able to prosecute the ones who are cyber-bullying, multiple harassment, REAL abuse as you have said, and etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rishwin
The internet is a public place, everyone can join it. Although, not many people know of the risks of doing it either. The internet isn't a giant social networking site where you can set it to "Friends Only", this is a real and huge public place. When first joining the internet, you don't know anything about it (like my parents), you learn for yourself what is there (this can be put to people who live alone with no children), or you have friends or children who can educate you on being safe while using it.
It is illegal to do harassment outside the internet, why not inside the internet? The Privacy laws may protect us for web surfing anonymity, but I'm sure if the incident is serious enough, there is a part in that law that says you will lose that anonymity if you are going to be involved in a case like these.
Also, Rishwin, I believe this is what they are so worried about :
"The new rules would apply to all websites - regardless of where they are hosted - but the claimant would need to be able to show that the UK was the right place to bring the action."
But then again, it didn't clearly state to me about that particular rule is solely in the UK or not, unless they mean that UK residents can take action against any website, which then I completely understand.
@MentaL, And you have the right to do that because you have taken the precautionary steps to do just that ^_^
I didn't read the article, you're right. However, it's pretty obvious what it's about. I don't know what you're on about saying that I have no understanding of the article.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rishwin
Did I ever say I was referring to name-calling or flaming? Obviously not, most abuse can be dealt with easily without involving any law. It doesn't matter what type of behavior it is, some people simply cannot quit their jobs. Yes you're right no one should be able to use the internet to escape prosecution, but that's not my point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rishwin
Do you know how hard it is for most people to find jobs? Billions of people don't have any sort of education degree and aren't able to find other jobs even given months to look. You probably grew up in a sheltered little environment where everyone in your city has a job and education, but in many places there are thousands of people without decent jobs living in poverty. That situation that I stated happens everyday to many people(do you know how many people there are?) Also, I've known people myself who have been unable to support their child without working a crap job that they despise. Millions of people have children before they should and are left in a situation like that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rishwin
Uhh, a sole proprietorship would have the sole proprietor as the manager... Even though it's not ideal management, it still can be an option if a co-worker is abusing you. Most businesses, regardless of the size of management, won't tolerate co-worker abuse as it's very bad for the business. Also, you call me naive yet you state such a great example of how naive you are about the world as a whole. Western Australia is 3% of the world's population at MOST, why do you act as though a statistic like that is relevant?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rishwin
less arguing please ^__^
No it's not, your point is in fact completely unrelated to the topic of this thread. Why you've pursued it thus far is beyond me.Quote:
Originally Posted by xLethal
All of that, garbage.Quote:
Originally Posted by xLethal
You don't seem to comprehend what we're talking about. ABUSE. I'm not talking about hating your shitty job, i'm talking about ENDURING PHYSIOLOGICAL ABUSE to the extend that it leaves permanent psychological scars in the form of chronic depression mental illness and suicide. These laws are in response to people being targeting using social media and other websites to abuse them in real life as well as offline, we're not just talking about them taking great offense to something they've read.
Uhh, it's a statistic which is relevant to me which provides a decent ballpark figure for arguments sake. I would love to see you somehow come up with an accurate worldwide statistic for percentage of sole proprietorships, and if you did manage to i'd bet a pretty penny it would be close to my figure.Quote:
Originally Posted by xLethal
I can atest to what he said, it is rather relevant to a degree. Used as symbolism if anything else. People who live in the US mainly, not everyone even has the option of educating themselves past high school, it's becoming more and more common nowadays. I am one of them, if I had the choice, I'd go, but it just doesn't fit the wallet without getting neck deep in debt for the rest of my life, so here I am. In any case, that's a little irrelevant but just an example.
He is talking about abuse from my point of view, maybe not the exact same kind of abuse your talking about Rish, but it's still abuse non-the-less. But we're also talking about the internet so real-life content is irrelevant.
I lol'd hard. All this legislation will do is drive communities whose culture is heavily derived from culture further underground, and cause their behaviour to become more fierce. 4chan is pretty powerful as it is (no, seriously, when they want to, they can seriously cause some clusterfuck) because there's already a high degree of anonymity. Have you seen the content that circulates there daily? Child porn and gore, for example. Do you think they're going to roll over and be like, "Oh shit! Trolling's illegal now? We best stop all that and be on our best behaviour, or else, right guys?" No, they're just going to spend the extra 5 seconds to fire up their proxy before they go ahead and troll people. So I'm happy that this legislation is being passed. Why? Because it won't stop the lulzy and intelligent trolling that the troll took some time to think through, but it might scare off the kids who think they're trolling but in actual fact are just repeating "u mad?" with a massive shit-eating grin on their face.Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith
Fuck that shit, I'm still gonna troll!!!
Was born a troll, will die a troll.
What's a troll?
Some people couldn't define troll if it butt fucked em. Majority of said "trolls" can't even grasp the concept properly let alone do it right.
Trolling has no limits therefore a proper define is not possible.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsume
I feel in a way that I've just been trolled by opening this thread.
Define "reveal" :).Quote:
Originally Posted by MentaL
That wouldn't be needed because half of this forum already posted their images here http://forum.ragezone.com/f10/picture-album-16582/Quote:
Originally Posted by jMerliN
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