Desbug 2Bi Exp

[Makloud]

The player to accumulate experience 2Bi is disconnected from the game, Quantum has made changes to the server and this disconnection by accumulating EXP disappeared.

Anyone know how would this change?

 

[bobsobol]

"Desbug" is not a word!!! What do you people mean when you say this? What do you expect me to understand?

"until today had no knowledge that change was made so that players do not have to accumulate DC 2bi to upload" I still don't. What does this mean? (Disconnection at 2 billion? 2 billion what? Why do I have to accumulate 2 billion anything in order to save or be disconnected? WTF!?)

"Anyone have knowledge of how this change was made and how?" No. I have no idea what you are talking about, but there are no notable modifications in the earliest server4096, and there isn't anything I noticed about at 2 billion disconnect in KPT ET2 that I recall. (I analysed the changes quite thoroughly, till I understood what each one achieved and could apply them separately)

So I have to ask what is this "All server" you are talking about which has a change that the ones I usually use almost certainly do not have.

 

[Vormav]

We always ask to include original language and use letters specific to your language (e.g. ê =/= e) for good reasons.
I might as well put it in bad translator and it will make as much sense:

...35 translations later Bing gives us:

"DC 2 exp 2 would be two updates today, and all disbog, I don't know what to do."

...if not more.

 

[bobsobol]

No, to be fair I've never known Makloud be so incomprehensible. (I have no recollection of it being a problem before) This "desbug" word comes up really often, and every time I think I know where it comes from I see it used in a way that it can't possibly mean that.

Originally, I thought it was a miss-spelling of "debug", but... no... it's more like bug-fix (seems to fit here) then I see it used like it's an item, or stat' and I'm just... "What!? What does it mean????"

I suspect that people have "hinted" (provide an alternative translation) to Google that it's a good translation for something or other enough times that Google translator believes them. Until recently Google translator certainly did translate the Portuguese word "itens" to "itens" as the correct English... and if you typed "items" as Portuguese, it would give "itens" as the English! Proving that it was not simply "falling through", it really did believe that "itens" was an English word. >.< (clearly another case of gospel according to Wikipedia, ie. if enough people believe it, and say so often enough it must surely become the truth )

 

[Makloud]

Sorry, I'm bad in English, and I use google as a tool, certainly many things get understanding.

Question:

The player to accumulate experience 2Bi is disconnected from the game, Quantum has made changes to the server and this disconnection by accumulating EXP disappeared.

Anyone know how would this change?

 

[bobsobol]

Hmm. I know QF made many changes to fix DC(4) (one of which is over Exp, but IDK where the 2 billion idea came from coz when I tested it was usually more than 2 levels, how-ever much exp that entailed) I don't use a Quantum server. It's usually my own mod of 4096, Shagpubs' mini KPT or the ET2. (with modifications) I suspect bits of QF work, or things learned from him are in those. But I didn't notice anything to do with over Exp in those servers.

As I say, in 1977 it certainly seemed to be level based, and the fact that it could be more, or less than 2 billion on that version and regular server tells me it's probably in the client, not the server at all.

That's not to say there isn't such code in the server, or just as likely in the SQL and Clan DLLs. I know there are checks... I just don't think the magic figure of 2 billion is. (From what I see)

 

[ScreamingFox]

I think it would be better to have a program that warns the ADM/GM when an (predefined) absurd amount of XP is acquired by a player, then they could deal with the user...


My thoughts on the languages...

Spoiler

The Portuguese prefix "des" tantamount to the English prefix "un", so, it would be a "un-bug".. Like 'untie'='desamarrar', 'to debug'(verb)='desbugar'. (so it probably could be unbug XD). I feel that the 'un' mean to eliminate or to reverse (like 'undead', in Portuguese, it would be translated as "desmorto" (so an 'undead' would be an dead person 'unkilled', 'dekilled' or 'diskilled' ), but in Portuguese (in Brasil at least) people say "morto-vivo" (which would be translated as "living dead")).


But there are some cases in the English that are quite similar i suppose, cases like 'to detach'='destacar', 'to degrade'='degradar'.. i think that those came from old borrowed words from Latin, French, Italian and Portuguese. (i suspect that 'debug' follows that line of thought). I suppose 'de' would mean to lower the intensity of presence (on the examples, of the attachment and grading).


Another prefix that i feel as similar as "un" and "de" (Portuguese "des") is the English prefix "dis", as in "discontent"="descontente", or "to dislike"="desgostar", i think it would 'reverse' the meaning of the original word. A 'disbug' would be... :?:mmm:?:.. something useful and good that came originally from a bug?


About the 'items'='itens'(Portuguese), there is a rule on Portuguese grammar that says - 'M' only goes before 'P' and 'B' (or of course, in the end of the word).


A very interesting thing i remembered (thinking of 'undeads' and stuff XDD) is of Zumbi of the Palmares (leader of the Palmares Quilombo (quilombos (read as 'kilombo', and Zumbi as 'Zum-bee') were places where black fugitive slaves settled a resistance, self-sustaining hidden communities, quilombos exist till today, and people who live on quilombos are called 'quilombolas'), the word 'Zumbi' can be translated as "ghost" or "specter", but also as "Alive Spirit" (the term 'spirit' was seen as different from 'soul', since (according to Paracelso) the 'spirit' is related to one's volition (or 'gases' or 'breath of life', indirectly tangible), and 'soul' is related to the presence of God within a personality, in this sense, a spirit can be vanished, sold, or transform, but the soul is one and only, can not be sold or killed, the Soul is completely intangible and transcendental, metaphysical) Zumbi of the Palmares was very feared among the slave-drivers, very charismatic, strong, and skilled with the spear, till today Zumbi of the Palmares ('Zumbi dos Palmares' in Portuguese) is revered as a great leader and symbol of resistance to the oppressed (especially black people)... XDD

 

[TrAnCe ^^]

can be more easy if it say "How to fix it" LOL

@Topic

How is your XP Rate to be need fix it , because standards values are better and without this bug visible..

 

[SheenBR]

search for binary: 33004748 and you'll find the DC4 procedure. just remove it, might aswell solve it.

 

[bobsobol]

i think it would 'reverse' the meaning of the original word. A 'disbug' would be... :?:mmm:?:.. something useful and good that came originally from a bug?

That would be an "exploit" then? (if you can gain advantage from a bug, it's called an "exploit")

I have to assume it means "bug-fix". I'm sure it would be "debug" except that "debugging" has become a practice of using a "debugger". (which, in it's self sounds like reversing the act of buggery, and yet, is not)

Removing a bug is bug-fix, finding bugs you didn't know existed, or knew but couldn't pin down is debug.

About the 'items'='itens'(Portuguese), there is a rule on Portuguese grammar that says - 'M' only goes before 'P' and 'B' (or of course, in the end of the word).

I think that's why "ciao" doesn't work, in English vowel pairs "ia" is impossible, hard "i" would be "y", but "i" can modify "a", as in "chair" becoming more like "chehr". XD But the other way does not happen.

can be more easy if it say "How to fix it" LOL

It is not a "bug", it is a highly valuable "feature" and therefore does not need "fixing".

Additionally, it isn't a single feature, but many many checks at either end of the connection. (client and server) Which is why I point out that the "2 billion" may apply to a certain client (probably 1873) but isn't an accurate description of the issue.

To avoid disconnection generally don't increase the maximum EXP of the client. (if you want more levels, use the Exp:Level ratio division method) If you upgrade to current client and current maximum level the old server4096.exe seems perfectly stable, with no DC and no alteration. (at normal Experience rate)

If you want 200× Exp rate... err... well you're asking for a server that crashes all the time anyway really aren't you. Better to crash players off and keep the server running a bit longer than remove this protection and boot everyone off every 5 minuets.

If you are still desperate to avoid either of these eventualities, I'd still recommend dividing the overall Exp:Level ratio over disabling overflow protection. (which is effectively what it is)

In any case, this "feature" has changed a lot in newer clients, so there is not 1 simple answer. The server hasn't changed... but I've never hit the server limits, and I've far exceeded 2 billion.

 

[SheenBR]

sandurr said something about. when you login, server "Holds" you actual exp. when the save packet is received (like a /save command) it compares the actual exp with the old one. if it is bigger than X, you get disconnected.

save char packet: 0x48470081
maybe some breakpoints and you might reach what he said, he also gave offsets, but I really dont remember where he posted that.

 

[ScreamingFox]

That would be an "exploit" then? (if you can gain advantage from a bug, it's called an "exploit")

I do not see an exploit as something good and useful. I think of 'exploit'(ing) as being very similar to hack using. An exploit would be good to 'bad players' who would eventually want to have unnatural advantages when playing a game. (or i am wrong about it and exploits can be used as something good, i mean, good, actually. not "mischievously good", but good indeed XD (remember that my knowledge of English is rather incomplete, so there are words i know very little about, just what i heard about them.. ).

An example would be the bugged up (or equivocally arranged) submaterial structure on the original Extreme Scythe (80d - wp120), that, when originally bugged, would not receive aging 'BLINK_COLOR', that would be originally considered a 'bad' thing, and lots called it a 'bug'.. you would not want a item that does not glow whereas all others glow on aging..

But, this bugged up material, that refuses aging effect, discovered as an error, would have a really good use, which is the possibility of an armor to accept the Aging/Mixing effect just on some parts (selective aging effect on armors).. In short terms, if age effects are enabled on the armor as a whole, but, on the parts i do not want the effects (the whole effected armor would not be so good to look at) i use the exact submaterial structure as the original 'bugged' wp120, only the parts i would want to be age-effected would have the effect.. It is basically in that sense that i could the use something called a bug for a good and useful thing.



About the Italian 'ciao', you would probably say it like "chall" (with the same 'ch' sound of the word 'chinese', and the same 'al' as in 'Albert')...

 

[bobsobol]

OT:-

Spoiler

I do not see an exploit as something good and useful.

Are you insane? If you can't exploit a bug, it's not useful. I can't imagine an exploit which isn't useful. (for something) Actually, if you can use any feature, documented (not a bug) or otherwise (any "undocumented feature" is a bug) for purposes other than their intention, you are "exploiting" that feature.

Let's have a "real-world" exploit. Okay, so you have an old fashioned "fuse box", you blow the fuse and fumble about in the dark looking for the fuse wire by candle light till you find the reel and... OMG! You're ¼" short of making the ends meet. It's dark and the house is getting cold coz the boiler is off for safety. <sigh> Oooh, wait a minute... what's this? Gum wrapper? <tahdah!> Exploitation = problem solved.

The "bug" is that any conductive material will operate the fuse box which is supposed to be a safety feature. That said, a house that risks you catching hypothermia during the night before the shops open and you can buy more fuse wire is probably not much safer than one burning down because of an overloaded circuit.

An exploit would be good to 'bad players' who would eventually want to have unnatural advantages when playing a game. (or i am wrong about it and exploits can be used as something good, i mean, good, actually. not "mischievously good", but good indeed XD

Software (or hardware) exploits in IT are not just about games. Clearly, the Superman example of a guy who puts all the fractions of a cent interest on everyones' account into his own, thereby taking nothing from the bank or it's customers and making a lot of money from this "nothing" is an ideal exploit. (I believe that was based on a real case, though I don't remember the details)

But really really good example of an exploit which does no harm to anyone and improves things in general? Something like

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would be a good example, or a

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wrapper.

I'll explain the latter, coz it's pretty neat. 3Dfx used to produce 3D graphics accelerator cards (additional to your graphics card which, at the time, only usually did 2D acceleration) then nVidia bought them out. Most 3D software which supported hardware rendering used 3Dfx APIs (either DOS or Windows) because OpenGL was the only alternative and it was 100% software based... on IBM PCs anyway. (CPU hungry) So how can you use that software now? How can you play those games on anything? Well, most GFX cards now have 3D acceleration built in, and that API (for Windows) is a DLL. So write a DLL with all the functions and procedures of the 3Dfx original that produces similar 3D image rendering with OpenGL / Direct3D! The flaw is that that DLL was supposed to only be produced, updated and released by 3Dfx, but they had to publish the API so developers could write for it. Exploit the API to create something new which does the same job without the hardware tie-in.

An example would be the bugged up (or equivocally arranged) submaterial structure on the original Extreme Scythe (80d - wp120), that, when originally bugged, would not receive aging 'BLINK_COLOR', that would be originally considered a 'bad' thing, and lots called it a 'bug'.. you would not want a item that does not glow whereas all others glow on aging..

But, this bugged up material, that refuses aging effect, discovered as an error, would have a really good use, which is the possibility of an armor to accept the Aging/Mixing effect just on some parts (selective aging effect on armors).. In short terms, if age effects are enabled on the armor as a whole, but, on the parts i do not want the effects (the whole effected armor would not be so good to look at) i use the exact submaterial structure as the original 'bugged' wp120, only the parts i would want to be age-effected would have the effect.. It is basically in that sense that i could the use something called a bug for a good and useful thing.

Yup. Exploit. No doubt about it.