Private The roller coaster ride of the Habbo section... ( What now? )

[PR0]

Hey everyone!

I've been an active member of the RZ Habbo section since I've joined. I've never really ventured outside of it due to I don't have interest in anything else.

I've noticed that over the years the Habbo section has had a lot of different phases which are usually determined by the main developers if they're helpful, mean, very critical, or just plain trolls. This is mainly because the Habbo section was originally to my knowledge designed for sharing resources, knowledge, and help.

For a while there, it seemed that everyone was very critical which discouraged a lot of users including myself to even bother releasing anything no matter how big or small.

What would it do for myself if I released something that looked great for use, but the backend of the project was messy. Well.. in the past it would have been a lot of flaming and discouragement. This mainly happens during the phase as developers who join the community are 12-16 and immature. When they're between 17-19 the section begins to get better, but then they leave as their skills become more professional and the quality of the Habbo section returns to the immaturity and poor quality products.

Currently, it's becoming more decent after some confronting threads have been posted in the discussion forums and people are becoming more helpful, calm, and informative. There's been a small increase of new developers releasing their projects, and so far it's going well and increasing at a slow pace. That's good, but not good enough.

I won't go down memory lane to cite all the times where this section thrived, however I've seen times when everyone was happy, humourous, helpful, and it was a great community in all meanings of the word community.

My question is this: How can we bring this community together to be more of a community?


Here are some of my ideas:

- Small developer and learning? That's fine!
You can still help organize a thread or resources to contribute. All the fixes of mercury, all the new CMS and emulators, images, customs, catalogues, etc! (Rickeymeiner was a huge contributor of these back in the day, not sure of his user now)- Have a developed project that you have no use for anymore? Post it!
It doesn't matter about the project name, or making it a huge release. Just include all the information you can about it, some screenshots and you're good! People will flame you, some will help, but overall there might be just one person who might be able to use it.

- SPEND MORE TIME ON YOUR RETROS! :glare:
The word quality and community are words I can't seem to be able to use to describe any retros out there today. The CMS used in all retros are minimal and poorly styled, usually lazy styling. The VIP packages are usually all the same, and the competitions are usually poor and unorganized.
Hotels start a community, then close it within a month. :grr: This is killing the whole retro community and scaring users away from it. Users make friends, then the hotel closes. How can you expect people to want to stay playing retros after an experience like that?!

- Be more helpful, nice, and have a non-biased opinion and/or advice
Ragezone is for MMORPG development. Nobody cares about your anger or negative comments, so please don't waste our time while everyone else scrolls through the thread. Post something quality, helpful, or even just a cool well put together opinion for feedback.




Well.. those are some of my ideas. Anyone else care to share theirs?

 

[Ddos Attack]

I agree about the up and downs. I joined retros (and habbo as a matter of fact) in a time when flash was relatively new and I sure have noticed a difference since then to now. I don't own a retro anymore so I'm a little out of pace, but of the time when I did, this section did change towards the end (start of this year-ish).
I think the biggest downer was when Phoenix was in full swing; most hotels used that emulator and everyone was the same, however the scenario has changed a whole lot since Phoenix died and that was for the better.

I also agree in regards to developments; The General's emulator is looking sweet and there are also other projects helping to shine some light.

In regards to creating a closer community and your ideas about having "unique" hotels, the problem is that once one hotel makes something unique, others will catch on and also want the "uniqueness"; making everyone equal.
I also think that releasing unused projects does help the community - when Butterfly R63B (or whatever it was called) was released, the amount of help everyone gave to improve the emulator was astonishing, and just showed how a community CAN work together.
I also can't agree more about simply being nice! Don't have something nice to say? Don't say it, simply move away.

Overall, I agree with the majority of your points

 

[The General]

I think the biggest downer was when Phoenix was in full swing; most hotels used that emulator and everyone was the same, however the scenario has changed a whole lot since Phoenix died and that was for the better.

I highly disagree. Sure hotels were the same but it was because Phoenix was a bit though to make it more unique however the activity was pretty high in this section. We all used the same standard (The phoenix database) for custom furniture and CMS' and stuff Now I think people don't post furniture anymore because of the massive amount of different emulators people use and their different databases. In the end there is atleast one person going to complain it is not working. This is for me why I semi quit custom furniture.

Same goes with CMS' as whenever some new CMS is released you can see the help section being spammed with threads in which people get errors cos of the way they don't properly work with all the different edits and renames.

When everybody used phoenix there were less of those help threads and you only saw threads about the common problems of Phoenix, the things people did wrong on a regular base and threads about setting up a hotel going wrong. Now it is all about mercury throwing these errors, plus emulator doing this etc etc.

I think a standard emulator wouldn't be a problem but the negative part of phoenix was that it was never updated to a newer release which made people move to habbolatino when that got released (Even though it was unstable back then).

With my development I'm just trying to get back to a standard which hopefully increases activity in this section. A emulator that is regularly updated and easy to configure to your liking. There will be a bug tracker for it so people can report ideas & bugs and it is just a emulator for the community and not a crappy butterfly edit.

In regards to creating a closer community and your ideas about having "unique" hotels, the problem is that once one hotel makes something unique, others will catch on and also want the "uniqueness"; making everyone equal.

I think this has been there since the beginning however I think it is a good way to eliminate the 'bad' hotels from the scene and it brings more competition so retro owners cannot just sit back and enjoy their use base go up anymore. People have to spend time on their hotel to make it better which I think is good. Brings new ideas and stuff n things.

I also think that releasing unused projects does help the community - when Butterfly R63B (or whatever it was called) was released, the amount of help everyone gave to improve the emulator was astonishing, and just showed how a community CAN work together.

Butterfly was stable untill the people with no knowledge started to f#ck it up. You forgot that most of the releases here are actually leaks (HabboLatino (which all started), firewind (crappy edit), the poop emulator from jordynegen, etc etc.).

 

[Jam32]

This is my unfortunate perception of the habbo section.


The best of it sunk along time ago, it wont be much longer for whats left to sink with it.
Many managed to get away, some are still on board running to the end in a bid to keep it alive.

Habbo itself is nothing compared to what it use to be, why people are still interested in trying to make a replica of it is past me! Obviously if things could be how they once was it would be beautiful. But I just dont think this sections ever going back.

Until good strong developers come in with the mindset to rejuvenate and lead the way, this section will never become as strong and solid community as it once was

 

[Jonteh]

Yay another one of these threads where discuss all the possible things that could change the habbo section that will never happen.

Let it go. Jam is right, this section has sunk just like Titanic.

 

[PR0]

This is my unfortunate perception of the habbo section.


The best of it sunk along time ago, it wont be much longer for whats left to sink with it.
Many managed to get away, some are still on board running to the end in a bid to keep it alive.

Habbo itself is nothing compared to what it use to be, why people are still interested in trying to make a replica of it is past me! Obviously if things could be how they once was it would be beautiful. But I just dont think this sections ever going back.

Until good strong developers come in with the mindset to rejuvenate and lead the way, this section will never become as strong and solid community as it once was

Personally for me the reason why I stick with the retro community isn't because I want to recreate Habbo itself. That sense of "emulation" did die a long time ago. I use Habbo as a base/environment for a fantastic community, or at least am currently planning to/developing for.

All the section needs to possibly get back to it was are Habbo retros. Think about how active the server advertisement was before, it was a full page (at least) of live and decently interesting retros. I think the section speaks for itself now.

Yay another one of these threads where discuss all the possible things that could change the habbo section that will never happen.

Let it go. Jam is right, this section has sunk just like Titanic.

Jonteh as a owner of some hotels for profit and your own hotel Zap itself, I believe that you contribute to the loss of the standards that retros used to have. (Non-profit, focused on quality, staff team, and community rules set a bar for the quality of a community).

The allowed swearing, profanity, vulgarism, sexist comments, literal pestering for nudes, etc which I witnessed on your retro which you were aware of was a huge turn off to see kids under 18 for that matter even speaking of this.

As an older person and a retro veteran I believe a retro owner like yourself should set a good example.

 

[Jonteh]

Personally for me the reason why I stick with the retro community isn't because I want to recreate Habbo itself. That sense of "emulation" did die a long time ago. I use Habbo as a base/environment for a fantastic community, or at least am currently planning to/developing for.

All the section needs to possibly get back to it was are Habbo retros. Think about how active the server advertisement was before, it was a full page (at least) of live and decently interesting retros. I think the section speaks for itself now.



Jonteh as a owner of some hotels for profit and your own hotel Zap itself, I believe that you contribute to the loss of the standards that retros used to have. (Non-profit, focused on quality, staff team, and community rules set a bar for the quality of a community).

The allowed swearing, profanity, vulgarism, sexist comments, literal pestering for nudes, etc which I witnessed on your retro which you were aware of was a huge turn off to see kids under 18 for that matter even speaking of this.

As an older person and a retro veteran I believe a retro owner like yourself should set a good example.

Yes, I set a very bad example. Who are you and what have you ever contributed apart from being over professional over a teenagers game? I can't even count the amount of times on my fingers that I've helped people in this community, released my personal work, or gone out of my way to help others. Maybe you need to open your eyes or get glasses.

The allowed swearing, profanity, vulgarism, sexist comments, literal pestering for nudes, etc which I witnessed on your retro which you were aware of was a huge turn off to see kids under 18 for that matter even speaking of this.

You honestly have no idea. When you run a community with over 2 million registered (like myself) - let me know how easy it is for you to moderate every small detail and how many users you'll have left once you ban people for swearing, using profanity, vulgarism, and sexual comments. Kids will be kids, if thats what they want to do on a retro then thats what they can do on a retro.

If someone asks someone for nudes (which I'm against, btw) then its up to them not to give them out like a Special person, not me. I'm a developer, not a babysitter.

Buddy, for the past months you've been talking about your brand new community, using crappy threads like this to try and get users, acting professional over a game for teens. We're all here for a bit of fun, I don't think anyone truly gives a duck anymore. And if you do, you need to grow up.

 

[PR0]

Yes, I set a very bad example. Who are you and what have you ever contributed apart from being over professional over a teenagers game? I can't even count the amount of times on my fingers that I've helped people in this community, released my personal work, or gone out of my way to help others. Maybe you need to open your eyes or get glasses.

You honestly have no idea. When you run a community with over 2 million registered (like myself) - let me know how easy it is for you to moderate every small detail and how many users you'll have left once you ban people for swearing, using profanity, vulgarism, and sexual comments. Kids will be kids, if thats what they want to do on a retro then thats what they can do on a retro.

If someone asks someone for nudes (which I'm against, btw) then its up to them not to give them out like a Special person, not me. I'm a developer, not a babysitter.

Buddy, for the past months you've been talking about your brand new community, using crappy threads like this to try and get users, acting professional over a game for teens. We're all here for a bit of fun, I don't think anyone truly gives a duck anymore. And if you do, you need to grow up.

My biggest hotel had 800 user peaks and a average of 200-300 online during the V26 days which was Ultima hotel, later in it's age was also co-owned by Jincos aka Matt from OS (Otaku). We always kept our standard for safety and quality. I realize your retro got to be gigantic at one point which is hard to manage, but that's what a safety/moderation manager is for. I believe you're a brilliant developer, however professional management in my opinion is key.

Jonteh I also understand and appreciate and have used your contributions to the community. I'm honestly not trying to create any hard feelings, just simply being extremely blunt and speaking my mind. My words directed to your personal retro are strictly opinions, and not facts.

Just so you know, on Prime we were using Illumina PRO for a bit. It's a beautiful project. I used a new template for it while also learning a lot of PHP and CSS. Without your contributions I wouldn't know what I know today. Thank-you.

Offtopic RE: My retro

Spoiler

As to regards of my retro, I did try opening it and did get try getting some attention at some points with different variations of software, but it didn't work out so then we look into other options and have been testing Mercury and now Marshmallow. We've also been developing our own CMS, and are taking our time with our content. We have constant conversations/do lots of research of the projects were using and have decided that Marshmallow is a great project to clean up, speed up, and fix bugs on due to it's base and current state.

We're not concerned about users at all, we're concerned about quality

 

[Jonteh]

My biggest hotel had 800 user peaks and a average of 200-300 online during the V26 days which was Ultima hotel, later in it's age was also co-owned by Jincos aka Matt from OS (Otaku). We always kept our standard for safety and quality. I realize your retro got to be gigantic at one point which is hard to manage, but that's what a safety/moderation manager is for. I believe you're a brilliant developer, however professional management in my opinion is key.

Jonteh I also understand and appreciate and have used your contributions to the community. I'm honestly not trying to create any hard feelings, just simply being extremely blunt and speaking my mind. My words directed to your personal retro are strictly opinions, and not facts.

Just so you know, on Prime we were using Illumina PRO for a bit. It's a beautiful project. I used a new template for it while also learning a lot of PHP and CSS. Without your contributions I wouldn't know what I know today. Thank-you.

Offtopic RE: My retro

Spoiler

As to regards of my retro, I did try opening it and did get try getting some attention at some points with different variations of software, but it didn't work out so then we look into other options and have been testing Mercury and now Marshmallow. We've also been developing our own CMS, and are taking our time with our content. We have constant conversations/do lots of research of the projects were using and have decided that Marshmallow is a great project to clean up, speed up, and fix bugs on due to it's base and current state.

We're not concerned about users at all, we're concerned about quality

"We're not concerned about users at all, we're concerned about quality" - I love it.

https://fresh-hotel.org/ - The hotel I manage. Feel free to check it out and you'll probably see just how professional I can be. This thread should be locked.

 

[PR0]

"We're not concerned about users at all, we're concerned about quality" - I love it.

https://fresh-hotel.org/ - The hotel I manage. Feel free to check it out and you'll probably see just how professional I can be. This thread should be locked.

I'm aware you manage that hotel. I think this is a good conversation regarding the heavy hitters of retros today and the state of how communities are.

 

[Jonteh]

I'm aware you manage that hotel. I think this is a good conversation regarding the heavy hitters of retros today and the state of how communities are.

It's not just the Habbo Retro scene that's dying because of how the way things are. Society in general has changed from when you and I first started in Retros, and as a result, so have online communities. I guess you just have to adapt with the times.

 

[PR0]

It's not just the Habbo Retro scene that's dying because of how the way things are. Society in general has changed from when you and I first started in Retros, and as a result, so have online communities. I guess you just have to adapt with the times.

Wow, that's a great point of contrast and good point. I made an interesting twist of a common saying on FB earlier "Lifes a witch.. so I'm either going to give it what it wants to make it easier or I'm going to duck it up the butt."

[ego] I'm the next Martin Luther King! [/ego]



PS. The revolution will not be televised.

 

[Jonteh]

Wow, that's a great point of contrast and good point. I made an interesting twist of a common saying on FB earlier "Lifes a witch.. so I'm either going to give it what it wants to make it easier or I'm going to duck it up the butt."

[ego] I'm the next Martin Luther King! [/ego]



PS. The revolution will not be televised.

I have no idea what you are saying. But, duck life right in the cat.

 

[Unphased]

My question is this: How can we bring this community together to be more of a community?

We don't. We leave the section to slowly become inactive and stop trying to bring the community together.

Rickeymeiner was a huge contributor of these back in the day, not sure of his user now.

That would be @Alpha Ducky

Hotels start a community, then close it within a month. :grr: This is killing the whole retro community and scaring users away from it.

And what the hell is that supposed to mean? You make it sound like a hotel closing is a horrible thing...

Well.. those are some of my ideas. Anyone else care to share theirs?

Nope. Nothing will change.

 

[Jonteh]

We don't. We leave the section to slowly become inactive and stop trying to bring the community together.



That would be @Alpha Ducky



And what the hell is that supposed to mean? You make it sound like a hotel closing is a horrible thing...



Nope. Nothing will change.

Rep for that.

If you care this heavily about the habbo section, you should probably find something else to do with your time.

 

[PR0]

Rep for that.

If you care this heavily about the habbo section, you should probably find something else to do with your time.

I care lots about anything I spend my time on, in my eyes I spend it wisely. #carpediem

Okay now that the pessimists have shared their opinions, and optimists out there?

 

[Ddos Attack]

I highly disagree. Sure hotels were the same but it was because Phoenix was a bit though to make it more unique however the activity was pretty high in this section. We all used the same standard (The phoenix database) for custom furniture and CMS' and stuff Now I think people don't post furniture anymore because of the massive amount of different emulators people use and their different databases. In the end there is atleast one person going to complain it is not working. This is for me why I semi quit custom furniture.

You have a good point there
What I meant in regards to Phoenix was that although Phoenix did create high activity, it meant that emulator development decreased because everyone simply used Aaron as their coder ;P Otherwise I agree with your points there.

Butterfly was stable untill the people with no knowledge started to f#ck it up. You forgot that most of the releases here are actually leaks (HabboLatino (which all started), firewind (crappy edit), the poop emulator from jordynegen, etc etc.).

Sorry, I meant Butterstorm. I know Butterfly was quite a stable and the crappy edits ruined that, but the community did come together to help release fixes for the crappy emulators. And it was that point in the habbo development that led to where we are today.

 

[PR0]

The amount of care you have for this section makes me want to kill myself.

What do you mean by care for a section? I care about habbo retro development and retros... it's my hobby lol. I don't understand why anyone else would look into retros if they didn't care about it.

 

[Jonteh]

What do you mean by care for a section? I care about habbo retro development and retros... it's my hobby lol. I don't understand why anyone else would look into retros if they didn't care about it.

I do retros because I have friends who I've known for years who still operate large ones and need help. I do it to further my programming knowledge, I do it basically so someone else has to less work and hopefully can learn also.

Retros are my hobby too. It doesn't mean I don't think they're shenanigans, and it doesn't mean I care about them. I care about 1-2 hotels out of hundreds, and definitely not the entire community.

The entire community doesn't give a duck about you, why should you about it. You posting this thread, discussing poop with maybe 3-4 people who'll participate properly isn't going to change the community. Nothing is going to change the community. You're like what? 20+? Most kids are 13-17 and don't give a duck about what some golden oldie like me or you is saying.

 

[PR0]

I do retros because I have friends who I've known for years who still operate large ones and need help. I do it to further my programming knowledge, I do it basically so someone else has to less work and hopefully can learn also.

Retros are my hobby too. It doesn't mean I don't think they're shenanigans, and it doesn't mean I care about them. I care about 1-2 hotels out of hundreds, and definitely not the entire community.

The entire community doesn't give a duck about you, why should you about it. You posting this thread, discussing poop with maybe 3-4 people who'll participate properly isn't going to change the community. Nothing is going to change the community. You're like what? 20+? Most kids are 13-17 and don't give a duck about what some golden oldie like me or you is saying.

I'm taking Technical Web Design in January then Software Development afterwards, so I'm learning right now as well and preparing for these.

I don't care about the whole retro community as a whole, just the main people who I recognize on retros and ones who have contributed selflessly to a community in order to help them. I haven't seen that kind of kindness many other places, which is why I care about this community on RZ. I see lots of people from the V26 days still lurking around.

My highest hope is that some old school people would return and stop lurking around and hopefully begin to actually get into it again. If they're interested enough to check in, I'm sure that means that there's a chance some people may return and maybe retry building a project they may have done in the past for contrast and the rustic value.

I've had a lot of great times on Habbo/retros and met so many people I would have never had the chance to in real life. The fact that I've done that in a happy and good environment before keeps me around and trying to bring back that standard for my hotel. I care enough to make an opinion on others, but don't care enough to give advice unless it's sought out. I'd be playing Habbo right now if they didn't fk it up and make all my friends leave. I'm hoping to create a community for all of them to come to, I did once with Prime but I was inexperienced and we had vulnerabilities. We had 40 average in 2 weeks, all unique retro players and a large community that I had lots of friends with on Habbo was the main chunk of that.

I have no motive to help/change the whole retro scene, but only to form an opinion and voice my disappointment.



( Also, because of all the knowledge retros have given me from such a young age, my teacher said the class will be extremely easy and I won't have a problem getting hired. )